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Post by OrthodoxWin32 on May 1, 2023 9:44:00 GMT -8
I do not understand you. The checkers pattern is used in all programs that use Windows controls. Including the 3rd-party ones. For instance, in File Locator Pro, Ripcord, uTorrent, Notepad++, Window Detective, Process Hacker, PaleMoon, even in the WinClassic theme I seem to have seen an exception before, but I can't remember which program. Same, I've seen this colors used in a program before, but in a control that had nothing to do with the scrollbar. |
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Post by anixx on May 1, 2023 10:33:23 GMT -8
I do not understand you. The checkers pattern is used in all programs that use Windows controls. Including the 3rd-party ones. For instance, in File Locator Pro, Ripcord, uTorrent, Notepad++, Window Detective, Process Hacker, PaleMoon, even in the WinClassic theme I seem to have seen an exception before, but I can't remember which program. Same, I've seen this colors used in a program before, but in a control that had nothing to do with the scrollbar. There are a lot of programs that imitate controls of classic theme, for instance, LibreOffice. They use another toolkit, so they do not show the checkers pattern. |
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torto
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Post by torto on May 1, 2023 17:17:22 GMT -8
I agree that very few programs use it, as most use the Windows controls, or if they don't they use their own skins without respecting the configured color.
One example where it is used correctly is on 2000/XP, on the "Add or Remove Programs" applet.
I just wanted to keep it similar to official versions, and to show the configured color in the preview, but yes, maybe it would be better to try to imitate the real controls...
Also, there are some colors which are not currently shown which could be added, like "selected item".
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Post by anixx on May 2, 2023 15:26:56 GMT -8
I agree that very few programs use it, as most use the Windows controls, or if they don't they use their own skins without respecting the configured color. One example where it is used correctly is on 2000/XP, on the "Add or Remove Programs" applet. I just wanted to keep it similar to official versions, and to show the configured color in the preview, but yes, maybe it would be better to try to imitate the real controls... Also, there are some colors which are not currently shown which could be added, like "selected item". ALL programs that use Windows controls show the checkers pattern! To display the scrollbar without that pattern in your program, you have to make a lot of effort! |
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Post by anixx on May 2, 2023 15:37:56 GMT -8
I agree that very few programs use it, as most use the Windows controls, or if they don't they use their own skins without respecting the configured color. One example where it is used correctly is on 2000/XP, on the "Add or Remove Programs" applet. I just wanted to keep it similar to official versions, and to show the configured color in the preview, but yes, maybe it would be better to try to imitate the real controls... Also, there are some colors which are not currently shown which could be added, like "selected item".
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torto
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Post by torto on May 8, 2023 5:33:26 GMT -8
Hi.
I've released a new version with some improvements in the preview, including the scrollbars
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Post by OrthodoxWin32 on May 8, 2023 10:41:41 GMT -8
Hi. I've released a new version with some improvements in the preview, including the scrollbars Thank you very much, this version fixes several problems, everything is almost perfect now ! I'm just dubious about adding the icon to the titlebar of previewer windows. It does not appear in the original desk.cpl. |
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Post by anixx on May 8, 2023 12:26:03 GMT -8
Thanks for the improvements! Currently, in the advanced settings dialog the settings (for instance, gradient in title bar) are applied instantly. But this is not how the classic windows dialogs worked (the changes should be applied on pressing OK or Apply).
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torto
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Post by torto on May 8, 2023 15:07:22 GMT -8
You're welcome! I wasn't sure about the icons either, but it's a situation similar to the scrollbars (which are still missing a handle btw), where in the original cpl it was different, but most normal windows do have an icon... The same happens with the Message Box, which I'm planning to change. Now it looks similar to the original cpl, but the system one looks like this:  (in the bottom part it uses the menu color, not the button color) And also the idea is to add to the preview other elements which were not originally there. Yes, I will change that. I don't know if for all settings, but at least for the ones which are exclusive to the classic theme (flat menus and gradients), which I was thinking of moving to the "Classic Theme" tab (so that you can see the preview instantly). |
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Post by OrthodoxWin32 on May 9, 2023 2:55:55 GMT -8
You're welcome! I wasn't sure about the icons either, but it's a situation similar to the scrollbars (which are still missing a handle btw), where in the original cpl it was different, but most normal windows do have an icon... The same happens with the Message Box, which I'm planning to change. Now it looks similar to the original cpl, but the system one looks like this: (in the bottom part it uses the menu color, not the button color) And also the idea is to add to the preview other elements which were not originally there. I understand the problem of difference with the system, but I think that adding the icons does not bring much, because it is not a configurable parameter. On the other hand, I find that adding the icons complicates the reading, because the viewer windows are very small (which is normal, since it is a preview). As for the Message/Dialog box, I don't agree. The Message box on your screenshot appeared since Windows Vista, there are also tips in this forum to return to the old Message box (similar to the one displayed in desk.cpl), and some programs use Message boxes with uniform colors (notepad.exe, for example). And above all, the "Message box" element in the viewer does not only take into account this type of Message box, but all windows with a border of the type "Dialog box". Including property pages, so including WinClassicThemeConfig itself. For example, these windows are actually Message/Dialog boxes :  Notepad message box.  Notepad remplace item dialog box.  Keyboard properties. All these message/dialog boxes contain only the button colors, absolutely not the menu color. These are original Windows 10 message/dialog boxes, there are no modifications. |
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Souper
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Post by Souper on May 9, 2023 13:03:09 GMT -8
going off of screenshots, while the scheme preview uses that unique color (in 9x), other native programs still use the checkerboard pattern. idk what the conditions to get programs to use the unique color would even be.
so that's i guess a potential leftover of when the scrollbar did use that unique color, but might've gotten changed, leaving the preview to be the last remainder of it.
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torto
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Post by torto on May 13, 2023 6:12:13 GMT -8
Hi! On the other hand, I find that adding the icons complicates the reading, because the viewer windows are very small (which is normal, since it is a preview). I will remove the caption bar icons for now. Yes, they do not add much, but I don't see how it would complicate the reading... do you mean because there are too many things in the preview? There was a problem with how they rendered, but it will be fixed when I add them back. the "Message box" element in the viewer does not only take into account this type of Message box, but all windows with a border of the type "Dialog box". Including property pages, so including WinClassicThemeConfig itself. One weird thing I've noticed with property pages is that, unlike other windows with fixed borders, it is affected by the border padding setting. For example, these windows are actually Message/Dialog boxes : Well, I think all those are dialog boxes, but not necessarily message boxes (a particular kind of dialog box using the MessageBox function). I guess my issue is that the preview says Message Box instead of Dialog Box.. Maybe I will change that instead. I think I should make the preview settings configurable, so that you can change how the scrollbar background looks, if the icons are shown or not, and to include or not extra elements...(trying to show all configurable colors, sizes and fonts really clutters the preview window  ) |
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torto
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Post by torto on May 13, 2023 6:19:45 GMT -8
going off of screenshots, while the scheme preview uses that unique color (in 9x), other native programs still use the checkerboard pattern. idk what the conditions to get programs to use the unique color would even be. so that's i guess a potential leftover of when the scrollbar did use that unique color, but might've gotten changed, leaving the preview to be the last remainder of it. The system scrollbars used the configured color on Windows 3.x and below. What is confusing is that, like anixx said, it showed on the preview the checkered background on 95, but not on NT4 or 98 and later. So maybe it was an intentional change.. who knows |
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Post by nonameneeded on May 13, 2023 6:38:14 GMT -8
tortoWould it be possible to save a complete design? By that I mean not only colors, but cursor settings, sounds etc.? Like it was on Windows XP? Like that, your tool could really replace desk.cpl on Windows 10/11.
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torto
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Post by torto on May 13, 2023 14:50:41 GMT -8
Yes, that would be cool! It could even use the same .theme files as the system. That format was almost unchanged from the 9x days, and even on 11 it contains the color scheme data for high contrast themes. So I could save them as high contrast themes, apply them the same way the OS does, and they would work with or without the classic theme enabled (using the aerolite style), and show up on the control panel / settings app. I don't make any promises I will do it very soon though  |
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Post by OrthodoxWin32 on May 20, 2023 9:40:59 GMT -8
Yes, that would be cool! It could even use the same .theme files as the system. That format was almost unchanged from the 9x days, and even on 11 it contains the color scheme data for high contrast themes. So I could save them as high contrast themes, apply them the same way the OS does, and they would work with or without the classic theme enabled (using the aerolite style), and show up on the control panel / settings app. I don't make any promises I will do it very soon though  Hi torto ! I also think adding theme support is a good idea. However, I think the best thing to do first is to add command line support. Indeed, it can be very useful to allow to apply a scheme with the command line. For .theme files, I think it's best to mimic how Windows XP works, with support for visual styles and the classic theme. The major problem in Windows 8 and above is that there is no way to automatically apply classic and basic themes. To remedy this problem, I see two solutions : either incorporate in WinClassicThemeConfig the possibility of activating the classic theme and the basic theme (like what I did here), or not to make a difference (read all the parts of the .theme, except for the visual styling part). Anyway, I think it's important to separate the "scheme" part and the "theme" part, it has always been different in Windows. |
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Post by OrthodoxWin32 on May 20, 2023 9:44:38 GMT -8
Hi! I will remove the caption bar icons for now. Yes, they do not add much, but I don't see how it would complicate the reading... do you mean because there are too many things in the preview? There was a problem with how they rendered, but it will be fixed when I add them back. One weird thing I've noticed with property pages is that, unlike other windows with fixed borders, it is affected by the border padding setting. Well, I think all those are dialog boxes, but not necessarily message boxes (a particular kind of dialog box using the MessageBox function). I guess my issue is that the preview says Message Box instead of Dialog Box.. Maybe I will change that instead. I think I should make the preview settings configurable, so that you can change how the scrollbar background looks, if the icons are shown or not, and to include or not extra elements...(trying to show all configurable colors, sizes and fonts really clutters the preview window  ) I understand for the icons on the windows. For the message box/dialogue box, I agree. Maybe rename this to message/dialog box Indeed, the case of property pages is quite strange. |
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Post by anixx on May 21, 2023 16:53:36 GMT -8
Yes, that would be cool! It could even use the same .theme files as the system. That format was almost unchanged from the 9x days, and even on 11 it contains the color scheme data for high contrast themes. So I could save them as high contrast themes, apply them the same way the OS does, and they would work with or without the classic theme enabled (using the aerolite style), and show up on the control panel / settings app. I don't make any promises I will do it very soon though It the current theme is high-contrast, there are unwanted consequences. For instance, browsers use high-contrast themes, system tray is displayed incorrectly. |
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torto
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Post by torto on May 22, 2023 13:17:07 GMT -8
It the current theme is high-contrast, there are unwanted consequences. For instance, browsers use high-contrast themes, system tray is displayed incorrectly. Yes, you are right. They don't have to be high contrast tough, the color scheme is also saved and read by the system on "aero"-based themes (not sure on the latest versions). |
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torto
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Post by torto on May 22, 2023 13:27:41 GMT -8
However, I think the best thing to do first is to add command line support. Indeed, it can be very useful to allow to apply a scheme with the command line. I can do that. Something like: /ApplyScheme "Scheme Name" "Scheme Size" For .theme files, I think it's best to mimic how Windows XP works, with support for visual styles and the classic theme. The major problem in Windows 8 and above is that there is no way to automatically apply classic and basic themes. To remedy this problem, I see two solutions : either incorporate in WinClassicThemeConfig the possibility of activating the classic theme and the basic theme (like what I did here), or not to make a difference (read all the parts of the .theme, except for the visual styling part). I was thinking of just letting Windows set the theme. So it would apply at the same time the normal skin and the colors used by the classic theme. However, the OS doesn't use anymore the [Metrics] section, containing fonts and sizes... that maybe could be worked-around by applying the theme and then "manually" the [Metrics] function.. |
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