herit://that1cutie
Sophomore Member
sad girl times
Posts: 165
OS: Windows 10
Theme: Shitbox Edition
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Post by herit://that1cutie on Dec 31, 2022 12:53:07 GMT -8
Just a bump that general consensus on these forums, and other communities now too, appears to be that you stole the name of someone else's project to use for yourself. Which is morally scant compared to a single developer closing the source to their own personal project (even though an older copy of the source is still freely available to those who take three minutes to look for it). Again, general consensus of those aware, not my opinion alone. You already know my opinion and I certainly can't stop your self-disenfranchisement. Guess I can only lead a horse to water here.
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Fierelier
Freshman Member
Posts: 35
OS: Windvn Daedalus (Devuan)
Theme: gtk-theme-raleigh
CPU: i5-520M
RAM: 4GB
GPU: Intel HD (Gen5)
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Post by Fierelier on Dec 31, 2022 17:17:55 GMT -8
I really don't care what you and your arbitrary group of people think about me. I won't bother to answer to you with anything productive from now on, if you keep making it about this. You made your point, I disagreed with it. That's that. I'm not interested in this conversation.
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herit://that1cutie
Sophomore Member
sad girl times
Posts: 165
OS: Windows 10
Theme: Shitbox Edition
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Post by herit://that1cutie on Dec 31, 2022 21:16:56 GMT -8
Fair enough. This "arbitrary group of people" is the Discord server for literally this forum, its the same people you're trying to get to use BSCT. You have to understand that joining a forum hurling insults doesn't exactly garner any users' respect. Sorry for harping. Obviously I have my issues here, but good luck on your program, genuinely. I hope you can achieve what you set out to do (and I hope you come around on the name but I can't force anything). I've seen your other works and you are clearly a skilled programmer, and I can't fault that.
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Fierelier
Freshman Member
Posts: 35
OS: Windvn Daedalus (Devuan)
Theme: gtk-theme-raleigh
CPU: i5-520M
RAM: 4GB
GPU: Intel HD (Gen5)
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Post by Fierelier on Dec 31, 2022 23:51:25 GMT -8
Alright, thank you. And no, I don't hate you. I just want to conclude this discussion is all.
Release version 1.5: * Separated all mods into scripts for each specific task, to make progress display more accurate, and to not have to implement all functionality. * Added init task to applicable mods. * Added StartOrderPre and StartOrderPost to config bat, which allows to set the order in which components start.
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Fierelier
Freshman Member
Posts: 35
OS: Windvn Daedalus (Devuan)
Theme: gtk-theme-raleigh
CPU: i5-520M
RAM: 4GB
GPU: Intel HD (Gen5)
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Post by Fierelier on Jan 1, 2023 19:57:19 GMT -8
Release version 1.6: * Added 3D borders via UPM.
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Post by leet on Jan 2, 2023 11:44:58 GMT -8
Why is it better?
* It's open source and will stay that way. * It introduces its own optional shell, to make the explorer.exe main process classic-themed. * All-in-one, configurable (if desired), installation/deinstallation. * The components are downloaded from original sources at run-time. * As much data as possible is kept within its own folder. * It can easily be expanded with your own modules. You have pretty much reached my limit now. Like seriously, make your own tool, do not reference Simple Classic Theme again, and shut the fuck up. Disliking something is fine, but being a pretentious dick about it is absolutely not. Your tool sucks so much that you have to start fucking lying to people about its place compared to other software. Making the system shell Classic Themed, having a configurable installer, downloading components when needed, staying within a folder and expandability are ALL key-features of Simple Classic Theme. Even being open-source does not make your software 'better' than SCT in any way, shape or form. You seem to combat anything we say to you, yet you still implemented Classic Theme Tray after I suggested it, saying 'thank you' as if you do not absolutely despise me. Your indignant behavior is sickening everyone on this, and other communities. Let me make it abundantly clear again: BSCT is not better than Simple Classic Theme. It is not a functionally equivalent replacement for it. It does not meet the quality standards that Simple Classic Theme passes through in its development. It is only an alternative if you do not like SCT somehow. Your tool is not even its own piece of software: because of the way it is built, it requires some other application to enable Classic Theme for it, making your method pretty much equivalent to anixx's method described on the ExplorerPatcher discussions page on GitHub. Do not pretend you reinvented the wheel. The only reason you were able to make this software is because of the knowledge and resources available in this community. We are all very dedicated to getting Classic setups working on newer versions of Windows and we have done a lot of research into it. To come into the community that did all the research and abundantly ignore everything they say, makes you yourself ego-centric. Everything has to be about the fact that you dislike Simple Classic Theme's closed-source natures, while nobody else seems to give a shit. Yes there have been concerns, but I intentionally said I will not discuss the reasoning because the development cycle will only improve from it. The rest is not important Your naming makes this whole situation even funnier. If you had just said that you do not agree with my decision to close-source SCT, and had uploaded your own thing with an original name, I would have totally praised you for making a lighter alternative. Yes, that is the only thing that makes this a feasible script for me: it is lighter than SCT in disk footprint. I do not need to be enlightened with your imaginative reasoning for why you are in the right here. You are not and I think everyone here agrees with that. Spare me the painfully stupid argument, and get your shit together. You are not better than anyone else here, so like everyone who made a contribution to the community, make up an original, non-derogatory name for fuck's sake.
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Post by R.O.B. on Jan 2, 2023 12:48:56 GMT -8
Alright, there's a lot of drama going on in this thread. Fierelier , I don't mind you sharing your project. In fact, I strongly encourage it. But I am going to have to ask that you give it a different name, as the current name is quite disrespectful towards leet and his work. You can disagree with the decision to make SCT closed source, that's fine. And you can discuss your opinion on the matter here as long as you keep it respectful. However, by naming your project "Better Simple Classic Theme" you are directly stating that your work is superior to his. Even if you consider it to be so, I cannot allow this type of rhetoric. Change the name to something with no connection to SCT, and let's keep discussion here civil and on topic. Otherwise, I'm locking this thread.
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herit://that1cutie
Sophomore Member
sad girl times
Posts: 165
OS: Windows 10
Theme: Shitbox Edition
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Post by herit://that1cutie on Jan 2, 2023 13:14:27 GMT -8
You can disagree with the decision to make SCT closed source, that's fine. And you can discuss your opinion on the matter here as long as you keep it respectful. However, by naming your project "Better Simple Classic Theme" you are directly stating that your work is superior to his. Even if you consider it to be so, I cannot allow this type of rhetoric. Change the name to something with no connection to SCT, and let's keep discussion here civil and on topic. I would like to add as well that Fierelier directly called Leet "stupid" in Leet's very own Simple Classic Theme topic.
Also, the URL for this very post says "simple-classic-theme" which is itself (edit: possibly) Fierelier's very active step toward attempting the erasure of Leet's program altogether. (disregard this one it's likely a cheeky coincidence)
I too would have only praise for this program but for the disrespectful nature from which it sprung forth.
You know, with the exception that BSCT messed up my system when I tried it, and the instructions in the readme solved nothing. This is ongoing.
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Post by OrthodoxWin32 on Jan 2, 2023 15:23:17 GMT -8
Alright, there's a lot of drama going on in this thread. Fierelier , I don't mind you sharing your project. In fact, I strongly encourage it. But I am going to have to ask that you give it a different name, as it is quite disrespectful to leet and his work. You can disagree with the decision to make SCT closed source, that's fine. And you can discuss your opinion on the matter here as long as you keep it respectful. However, by naming your project "Better Simple Classic Theme" you are directly stating that your work is superior to his. Even if you consider it to be so, I cannot allow this type of rhetoric. Change the name to something with no connection to SCT, and let's keep discussion here civil and on topic. Otherwise, I'm locking this thread. Yes, it is quite possible to disagree with a decision while respecting the author of this decision. Personally, I don't agree with leet's decision, but I would never disrespect him. And frankly, leet didn't try to close the sources of previous versions of SCT. Conversely, all previous versions are open-source, and even part of the code of the future closed-source version (MCT). So much ado about not much.
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Post by OrthodoxWin32 on Jan 2, 2023 15:35:27 GMT -8
You know, with the exception that BSCT messed up my system when I tried it, and the instructions in the readme solved nothing. This is ongoing.
This does not surprise me; bat scripts are quite powerful, but it's easy to make a coding mistake that damages the system. This is aggravated by the lack of a debugger (there is one I think, but it is not very powerful anyway). I know what I'm talking about, I'm working on a series of scripts quite similar to those of Fierelier, I have to check everything in detail (it's also because I'm less experienced in this programming, but still). For your system, I think it's fixable though, you just have to figure out what went wrong, to do it the other way around. Fierelier I think it would be good to test the scripts in a virtual machine before publishing, even if you seem more experienced than less in bat scripts.
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Fierelier
Freshman Member
Posts: 35
OS: Windvn Daedalus (Devuan)
Theme: gtk-theme-raleigh
CPU: i5-520M
RAM: 4GB
GPU: Intel HD (Gen5)
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Post by Fierelier on Jan 3, 2023 4:20:49 GMT -8
leet You're full of yourself. 90% of the stuff you say is you being jealous, causing drama on purpose with empty claims and implications of corporate quality. Your software sucks because it's closed source, and I have the moral high ground because my software is open source. That's that. R.O.B. OK. herit://that1cutie I need more details to fix whatever issue you're having. Like what do you see, exactly? I also never chose that URL, I'm not sure if it's even possible to decide that. Please do more research before making such a claim. OrthodoxWin32 I constantly test my scripts within a 21H2 VM, the screenshot in the main post is from that testing.
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herit://that1cutie
Sophomore Member
sad girl times
Posts: 165
OS: Windows 10
Theme: Shitbox Edition
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Post by herit://that1cutie on Jan 3, 2023 9:07:25 GMT -8
Okay on the URL, I edited my post about it. Looking in, I couldn't figure out how to change the URL of a post. It is a pretty cheeky coincidence though. It seems that you were able to change it though when you renamed your software.
Hands down your software is not better than the other one. Leet has nothing to be jealous of compared to your software. Your software is hacked together and barely works. It uses other people's softwares for every important function because you cannot code your own software. If you are so upset about a program for Windows being closed source then I've got some news for you buddy, you shouldn't be using Windows in the first place.
Doubling down against the empirically proven is not a good look.
And after all this mess I do not trust you to be able to fix my computer after what your program did to it. All of my colors are messed up all of my programs are messed up I cannot uninstall your program. You have permanently set my configuration to your windows color scheme and even after uninstalling it I cannot put it back to the way it was before.
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Post by The Jackal on Jan 3, 2023 10:49:33 GMT -8
leet You're full of yourself. 90% of the stuff you say is you being jealous, causing drama on purpose with empty claims and implications of corporate quality. Your software sucks because it's closed source, and I have the moral high ground because my software is open source. That's that. You joined this forum and your first post was to shit on a long standing and long contributing member of this community's work. Not a good first impression I must say. And then the way you continue to conduct yourself has been equally poor. Your software being open source doesn't give you the right to be an ass, so quit it.
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Fierelier
Freshman Member
Posts: 35
OS: Windvn Daedalus (Devuan)
Theme: gtk-theme-raleigh
CPU: i5-520M
RAM: 4GB
GPU: Intel HD (Gen5)
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Post by Fierelier on Jan 3, 2023 14:29:45 GMT -8
herit://that1cutie I've had it with you. Since you're not willing to go into the issue in detail and given your obvious bias, I'll assume you're lying. If your issue IS real, you're a condescending piece of work for thinking I couldn't fix it. You're not here for any productive reason, so just stop bothering me. All you do is stir up drama with your constant, useless blabbering.
Also, the URL is based on the thread topic. Create a "Better Simple Classic Theme" thread and see the URL for yourself. And don't come up with some twisted explanation again to somehow implicate some bad intention. I'm tired of your baseless theory-crafting.The Jackal Imagine having an opinion, I feel I have been liberal enough with it. People are horribly blowing it out of proportion. This is just a constant barrage of hate, here. I feel people are being oblivious to the fact that SCT is not some complicated program. It isn't due as much credit as you all give it. The author said himself, it's simple, and the methods are publicly known.
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Post by OrthodoxWin32 on Jan 3, 2023 15:39:57 GMT -8
OrthodoxWin32 I constantly test my scripts within a 21H2 VM, the screenshot in the main post is from that testing. Thanks, that reassures me.
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Fierelier
Freshman Member
Posts: 35
OS: Windvn Daedalus (Devuan)
Theme: gtk-theme-raleigh
CPU: i5-520M
RAM: 4GB
GPU: Intel HD (Gen5)
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Post by Fierelier on Jan 3, 2023 16:49:47 GMT -8
Release version 1.7: * Changed all remaining branding from BSCT to OCT.
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Fierelier
Freshman Member
Posts: 35
OS: Windvn Daedalus (Devuan)
Theme: gtk-theme-raleigh
CPU: i5-520M
RAM: 4GB
GPU: Intel HD (Gen5)
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Post by Fierelier on Jan 4, 2023 0:24:36 GMT -8
herit://that1cutie My apologies, I must have read over your description of the issue after you said "I do not trust you to be able to fix my computer"... I'm just really wound up from all of this. Very sorry. You have permanently set my configuration to your windows color scheme and even after uninstalling it I cannot put it back to the way it was before. The color scheme is reset by selecting the default theme from within the themes folder. I'll automate this some more with the next update, sorry again for not reading.
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Fierelier
Freshman Member
Posts: 35
OS: Windvn Daedalus (Devuan)
Theme: gtk-theme-raleigh
CPU: i5-520M
RAM: 4GB
GPU: Intel HD (Gen5)
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Post by Fierelier on Jan 4, 2023 15:29:29 GMT -8
Release version 1.8: * Automatically revert color scheme on uninstallation. * Add utility for enabling 3D borders in themes folder, since choosing a theme disables them (this is only visible after logging out and logging back in).
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herit://that1cutie
Sophomore Member
sad girl times
Posts: 165
OS: Windows 10
Theme: Shitbox Edition
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Post by herit://that1cutie on Jan 4, 2023 15:54:02 GMT -8
herit://that1cutie My apologies, I must have read over your description of the issue after you said "I do not trust you to be able to fix my computer"... I'm just really wound up from all of this. Very sorry. You have permanently set my configuration to your windows color scheme and even after uninstalling it I cannot put it back to the way it was before. The color scheme is reset by selecting the default theme from within the themes folder. I'll automate this some more with the next update, sorry again for not reading. I guess I got heated too after having all these arguments followed by testing the program for *this* to happen. Certainly too frustrated to accept help or look into how the .theme files are written.
Okay so setting it to default set it to something similar to Windows Aero, which I guess is a good starting point. My main issue at this point is that the classic theme provided here is a combination of Windows 95 and Windows 2000. It uses the Windows 2000 ButtonFace, Menu, and MenuBar value. Maybe not exactly, but it's certainly a different colour than Windows 95 or 98, but it also uses the non-gradiated titlebars from Windows 95. The provided colour values are incompatible with the rest of the ones I've set myself (which are accurate to Windows 95-98 specifically) and this led me to think things broken. I'm now under the impression that this all can be edited from within the .theme file itself, using notepad++. Once I get the colour values shifted a bit I'll post it back here.
Every single time I click on a .theme file to apply it, it applies, then asks me if I want to send it to the recycle bin which makes no sense. Often it asks multiple times per click. I never told it to do this.
For example on the incompatibilities, I have an ExplorerFrame.dll.mun file (which is free here to use if you like) which replaces the rocker buttons with the classic looking ones from Windows 95-98. It however uses a very specific shade of grey (Windows 95-98) to cover up the aero rocker button inlay (because I couldn't figure out what exact colour the chroma was. But because it is only compatible with that very specific shade of grey at the moment, there's literally a butt-print around the rockers. It looks pretty funny actually.
Also, changing GradientActiveTitle value does not reenable the gradient and in fact changing that value seems to do nothing at all. I miss the gradient.
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Fierelier
Freshman Member
Posts: 35
OS: Windvn Daedalus (Devuan)
Theme: gtk-theme-raleigh
CPU: i5-520M
RAM: 4GB
GPU: Intel HD (Gen5)
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Post by Fierelier on Jan 4, 2023 19:45:54 GMT -8
My main issue at this point is that the classic theme provided here is a combination of Windows 95 and Windows 2000. It uses the Windows 2000 ButtonFace, Menu, and MenuBar value. Maybe not exactly, but it's certainly a different colour than Windows 95 or 98, but it also uses the non-gradiated titlebars from Windows 95. The classic.theme provided should be the colors from Windows 2000, I specifically exported it from Windows 7, it is called "Windows Classic" there, hence the name I chose for it. The gradient titlebar being on/off has nothing to do with the .theme file itself, as far as I know. It should work by default, and the colors in the .theme file should do something. The gradient titlebar being gone could be related to UPM being altered or broken. UPM is usually 64 bits long (16 hex characters in regedit). I could imagine that, for whatever reason, your UPM might have been a different length (which should never happen, usually), which could have resulted in my program breaking your gradient title bars. Or perhaps, you have disabled gradient titlebars in another program by accident. I exported the default UPM for you, as it's found in vanilla W10: reg add "HKCU\Control Panel\Desktop" /v UserPreferencesMask /t REG_BINARY /d 9E3E038012000000 /f -- If you apply this and relog, it should bring back your gradient title bars. But you might have to set some of your performance preferences once more in Advanced System Settings. If this works, run 3dBorders.bat once more, relog, and you should see 3D borders + gradient title bars. Every single time I click on a .theme file to apply it, it applies, then asks me if I want to send it to the recycle bin which makes no sense. I think this is related to you already having a theme of that name installed, W10 is asking you if you want to remove the old theme of the same name. Usually, prompting for recycle bin is disabled, and you wouldn't see this. This is an oversight on Microsoft's part.
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